Episode 045 – Allan Langer
Welcome to another episode of The HERO Show. I am your host Richard Matthews, (@AKATheAlchemist) and you are listening to episode #45 with Allan Langer – Learn How to Level Up Your Sales by Selling Less.
After nearly two very successful decades in sales – consumer sales, in-home selling, B-to-B sales, business development, and fundraising – Allan Langer has come to realize that almost all potential customers, no matter their shape, size, income or intellect, all share one consistent sentiment … they DO NOT want a sales pitch. They do not want to feel coerced. And they absolutely do not want to be “closed.”
Allan uses his years of experience and proven customer skills to help people as individuals, or the company, kick the same old tired sales philosophies and “techniques” to the curb, and show people how to: sell more than ever in your career, help people and not sell people, garner more referrals than ever before, and actually feel GOOD about what you do and how you do it.
Here’s just a taste of what we talked about today:
- The sales pitch was established for a reason; but is no longer wanted by today’s customers.
- Learning to hear customers and how they want to be sold.
- Helping people instead of closing people.
- From sports to sales.
- Getting people comfortable with you is the key to sales.
- Understanding people’s fear of salesmen.
- The benefits of discovering your “happy place.”
- Selling more by selling less.
- A small switch of mindset can make a huge difference.
- When the friction and pressure are gone, people will be more comfortable.
- Understanding body language.
- Facial expressions are the worst way to read a person. Their feet and legs give better clues to what they’re thinking.
- Looking at your customer as a friend in need instead of an enemy that you have to conquer.
- Having a mentor is critical. The best thing a mentor can do is to help you find your true self.
- Animate. Calibrate. Modulate. Adulate.
- Calibrate: taking a step back and looking at where you’re going, where you came from, and what path you’re on.
- “The 7 Secrets to Selling More by Selling Less”
- Knowing when to stop for the day.
- Quickly adjust & thinking on your feet.
The HERO Challenge
Today on the show, Allan Langer challenged Pam to be a guest on The HERO Show. Allan thinks that Pam is a fantastic interview because she is an amazing networker and event planner.
How To Stay Connected With Allan Langer
Want to stay connected with Allan? Please check out his social profiles below.
- Website: allanger.com
Call To Adventure
Don’t forget you can stay connected to me and the show by subscribing now. Just text ALCHEMY to 444999. Or, you put your email address in the box at the bottom of this page. You’ll get all sorts of cool gifts, be updated about our contests and polls, and get notified when we publish new episodes. With that… let’s get to listen to the episode…
The Webinar Alchemy Workshop: https://richardmatthews.me/fs/waw-slf/
Hello, and welcome back to the HERO Show.
My name is Richard Matthews, of course.
I’m on the line with Allan Langer. Allan, are you there?
I am here. Can you hear me?
I am. We had a bit of trouble getting our interview
Started today. But that’s okay. So Alan, let me just do
A quick intro for you. And then we’ll get right into this show.
You are Allan Langer, you’re a speaker, sales coach,
Author and sales consultant. You’re the author of
The Seven Secrets to Selling More by Selling Less.
You spent nearly two successful decades in sales,
Consumer sales, in-home selling, B2B sales,
Business development, fundraising, and basically
Realized that nobody likes to be pitched and closed.
So you got into the sales coaching business,
Which leads us, I think, really to the first part of the interview here.
Which is, what are you known for today?
What is it that people come to you to learn and
Figure out and better themselves with?
What I’ve learned, is over the years, the sales pitch
Is trained for a reason. It’s there to help reps make sales
And follow the protocol of the company.
But customers today, and as as I went along in sales,
They don’t want the sales pitch. So, people come to me
And they want to know how I actually am successful in selling
Without actually following the ABC sales pitch
That most reps are trained.
Always Be Closing.
Always Be Closing and also in reference to
“Okay, I have to follow the script, I have to go all right,
I gotta do this, then this, then this, I’m not gonna listen
To the customer, I’m just going to follow the steps
That they taught me,” and most of the time the customer
Doesn’t want to hear the first seven steps. They maybe
Only interested in Step Nine. So you have to figure that out
As a sales rep when you’re front of a customer
Of what exactly that they want to hear.
So what you’ve sort of become known for is helping people
Master that. Be better at it learning to hear their customers
And sell the way customers want to be sold.
Correct. And really change the mindset.
Everyone’s mindset in trainingwise,
And even when you get into sales, the mindset is,
“I need to make a sale, I’m meeting this person to make a sale.”
And that’s not true. You’re actually meeting that person
To help them solve their problems. And if you do that,
And forget about the sale end of it, you’ll be much more successful.
It’s actually, it’s something I found a lot in my business, as well
Is that if you realize that sales is actually the-
I think it’s probably the one of the highest mind jobs there is.
Because what you’re doing essentially is you’re finding people
Who have a problem and connecting them with solutions.
You’re like a solutions connector. And if you start thinking
Of sales that way, then it’s a lot easier to do
Because you’re not looking to sell someone.
You’re looking to help them solve a problem.
And that may or may not be your product or service.
So sometimes the best sale is the one you don’t make.
A hundred percent and I have a chapter in my book called,
‘The Helping Percentage’ because I always hated the term
‘Closing Percentage,’ or I closed a customer.
It always sounded very negative. And like you take a customer.
Exactly. So it’s adversarial almost. So I put in my book
That everyone, every sales organization should
Change that term to the helping percentage.
And how many people did you help today
Rather than how many people to close today?
Just a mindset thing. Really?
So let’s dive right into the actual, the the rest of the stuff here.
Let’s talk about your origin story. Every hero has an origin story.
It’s where you started to realize that you were different,
That maybe you had superpowers, and maybe you can use them
To help other people. Where did you start to develop or
Discover the value that you could bring people
This whole entrepreneurial journey that you’re on.
It’s an interesting story, because I had
My first professional career was in college athletics, actually.
I was hired right out of college to do statistics.
It was called Sports Information. I did the statistics.
Then, I worked my way into marketing, and then
Fundraising for college athletics. Actually, it was
At Columbia University in New York City for the last
Three years of my career there. Great job, a lot of fun.
People were envious because I was on the sidelines all the time
Running football events and basketball events.
But burned out after 15 years.
You’re working 80 or 90 hours a week. So I was very good
At what I did. … won a lot of national awards,
Especially for my marketing and fundraising. So one day,
I’m chatting with a buddy of mine, we’re having dinner
And I was really having thoughts about what I should be doing next.
And he said to me, why don’t you get into sales? And I said, “Sales?”
I said, “Who the heck wants to get into sales?”
It’s such a taboo word. And I said,
“I don’t know how to be a salesman.” And he laughed at me.
He said, “Don’t you fundraise for a living?
Don’t you sell season tickets? Don’t you call newspapers and
Try to get stories about athletes?” I’m like, “Yeah.”
He goes, “Well, you’re selling every day.
You just don’t even know it.” So it really got me thinking and
I gave my month’s notice the next day, actually.
And that’s how I got into sales. So about,
I don’t know, six weeks later, I was hired by this general contractor
To do his business development. And then from there I went on to
In-home sales and some B2B stuff. And that’s where
I really started to realize that not only am I good at this but
I like helping people solve their problems.
And I like kind of teaching what I can do
Because I was the number one sales rep for many, many years
At this large at Andersen Windows. And it was funny,
My direct boss always said to me, “What you do can’t be trained.
You’re just a feel-salesperson, you just have a great feel for it.”
And I said, “I disagree.” I said, “I think everything I do can be trained.”
And that’s kind of why I wrote the book, actually.
Because someone told you you couldn’t.
Because someone told me I couldn’t.
I like it.
That’s how I do most of the things my life. So, “
“You can’t do that,” then “Watched me. Watch me do it.”
So my curiosity on that is, did you learn over
The course of your sales career, that it doesn’t matter
What you’re selling? That your skills could be applied
Regardless of what you were plugging into the actual sales process?
So it’s funny, I can go back and feel or almost look
At the roadmap of – you join an organization,
They send you into the training class. And both organizations
That I went to these official training classes,
They were both a week-long training classes,
And you learn the pitch, you learn,
Okay, this is what I’m supposed to do, learn about the product.
And then this is how I sell the product.
And then this is how you handle objections. And this is how,
You do all these little sales techniques that they train you.
And as I got out of those training, I’m young, I mean,
I don’t know anything about sales, technically,
The technical parts of sales. So I went into meeting people.
And I was following that pitch, I was following that routine.
And I was realizing that it only worked
About 30% of the time, maybe less.
And it started to dawn on me that most sales organizations
Consider a 30% closing rate successful.
You have a 30% closing rate, you’re a good rep, you’re fine.
This is what we want. But I look at it from the other side
Of the glass. If I meet 100 people, and 70 of them tell me “No,”
I think there’s something wrong.That’s to me, that’s not even
Close to successful. So how can you meet 100 people
And 70 of them say that they don’t want your product.
Something’s wrong with that. So that’s when
I started thinking differently. I said,
“I really got to start listening to customers.” And, if this one
Doesn’t know, want to know about the glass package,
Well, then I’m not going to tell them about it.
If they just want to know the color of the window and
How it’s going to keep their house warm.
And that’s going to help them and they’re comfortable with me.
That’s all they need to know. And that’s what I started
Really saying, “Wow, this is I have something here.”
And that I really started to dig into the specifics
Of what I do with customers.
So what was your your close ratio with the windows,
Window thing, if it wasn’t 30%?
I was, I always hovered right around 60.
That’s crazy. Because in I know in the marketing and sales world
Where we do a lot of training and teaching.
And that we tell people that in almost every situation,
You’re never going to have a greater than 50% close rate.
So most people are – Most of the people you interact with,
They’re going to say no to you. Because that’s just-
That’s the reality of sales and marketing for most people.
Have someone coming in saying – in your case,
Most of the people I talked to say, ‘Yes.’ Which is
Which is crazy. So to to push it on. We talked about your
Superpowers. And what is it that you do or build or offer
This world to help solve problems for people?
The things you use to slay the world’s villains?
Sounds to me like you have a superpower
In getting people to say ‘yes,’
But what would you say your superpower is?
I think my superpower is to getting people to be comfortable with me.
Saying ‘yes’ is I never go into it. I never go into
A sales situation anymore. Wanting to make a sale.
If sales is the ultimate culmination of meeting, that’s great.
If they buy the product, that’s great, because then I know
That they trust me and this product is going to help them.
But if I go in there, and I’m like, “Oh my god,
I better I’m all for my last five, I better make this sale.”
The customer is gone. You’re thinking about yourself
And they smell that immediately. You can never think about
Yourself and sales ever, ever, ever, ever.
And so I think my superpower is when I get
The customer feedbacks and the testimonials and stuff.
It’s always about, “Allan made me feel real, really comfortable.
He didn’t, he wasn’t like a salesman.” I hear that all the time.
“He wasn’t like a typical salesman.”
And that’s unfortunate because the world is full
Of typical sales people. And that’s why people
Don’t want to meet with sales people.
They don’t want the sales pitch. They don’t want that feeling of-
That whole feeling of being in control, actually,
It’s the same way I approach sales, as well.
Where, I’ll get on the phone with someone and
I’ll start that off the conversation or like my goal here
Is not to sell you my products or programs.
My goal is to find out what it is you need help with.
And if there’s a great fit, great. If not, I’ve got lots of connections,
I can point you in the right direction. So, let’s just sit down and
And people appreciate that. They appreciate that.
Talk through like, “What it is that you need?”
You’re not there to quote unquote, sell them.
And when you really get down to it,
You realize that that is sales.That’s the way sales should be.
And this thing that everyone else calls sales is more like,
I don’t know something else. It needs a different name. Abuse, maybe.
Well, you know it. It’s interesting because when I was thinking
About doing the book and kind of organizing things,
The one thing in the back of my mind has always been,
Why don’t people like to meet with sales people?
Is that just me thinking that like? Do people really don’t want
To meet with salespeople? So before I wrote the book,
I actually did an unofficial experiment. For two weeks,
I asked everybody I met and no matter who it was,
Whether I knew them or not, this is the same question.
Do you like meeting with a salesperson?
And it turned out I asked 263 people in a two week period,
And every single one of them 100% said, “No.”
So 100% of people that I spoke to in two weeks said,
They do not like to talk to a salesperson.
So I came up with it in my book, I came up with it,
I called it a phobia. It’s not officially a phobia
But the fear of talking to a salesperson,
I called it “rip-the-trust-a-phobia.” It’s a kind of a made up term
In my book that people are not born with this.
It just comes from being ripped off and being felt
Being made to feel like you were not comfortable with,
When you were purchasing something.
And it just grows and it stays in your body.
And then all of a sudden, when you’re an adult,
You don’t ever want to meet with a salesperson.
You walk into the mattress store and you try to hide in the corner.
You don’t want the guy to come over to you and
Obviously the car salesman staff and even walking into a store.
You automatically blurt out, “I’m just looking.”
Even though you may need help finding something.
So it’s just that innate fear of being ripped off and
Being felt uncomfortable, made to feel uncomfortable.
Absolutely. And it’s such a like a deep problem
Because sales is what literally makes the world go round.
So literally, it makes the world go round. And every industry there is –
So without the sale. There’s nothing, t here’s no-
If you think about all the things that you bought,
Everything we’re using today, someone sold it to you somewhere.
So, sales is just such a fundamental part of commerce that –
To have most adults, in your case, you said
You asked 260 people and 100% of them said, they don’t like it.
There’s like a fundamental problem with the way,
Surprisingly, sales people are approaching sales.
So that’s why I say in this book, you will become
The salesperson that people actually want to talk to.
You won’t be lumped into the typical pool of
The snake skin or snake oil salesmen persona.
In the sales realm, you don’t get to make that distinction until after
You’ve met with the customer. Have you got any like strategies
That help alleviate that fear before you actually get
In the room with the customer?
Well, what you do on the phone is an excellent way to start
Any sales conversation, basically saying,
“I’m not here to sell you anything. I’m here to help you.”
I start every conversation I had had for the last seven years.
“Hi, Mr. Mrs. Smith, my name is Allan. Just so you know,
You’re not going to get a dog and pony sale show for me.
I’m just here to find out what your problems and
Let’s see if I can help you. Does that sound okay?
And you almost every single time you see this wash of relief
Come over their faces because they’re all geared up
For the sales presentation. They’re all geared up
To be pressured by something. And when you say,
“No, I’m not going to do that. That’s not what I do. Let’s figure out
How we can help, how I can help you.” That right there,
Pulls the pin out of the pressure balloon and
Makes them relax a little bit. So that’s a good way
To start any any type of sales situation.
So we actually do something very similar in because
We use webinars and micro webinars and
Sales videos online for marketing purposes to drive sales calls.
And we say the same kind of thing, “Stephen, get someone
To get on the on the phone with us.” Where we’ll say,
“Hey, we want to actually help you solve a problem.
And the work that – like this is what the call is going to actually –
How it’s going to go right we’re going to get it get on.
Find out where you are. Where you want to be healthy.
Build a plan to get there. And if our products or services
Make sense for you, we might offer them.
But the point of the call is not to close the sale.
The point we call is to help you see where you are
And where you want to get to. And so we use language
Like that to actually get people to even raise your hand and say,
“I’d like to have a sales call.”
And that differentiates you from 80% of everyone else
Who’s out there. I mean, think about you’re doing stuff online.
Think about that realm of how many times people
Are inundated, especially professionals like you and me,
When we’re on Facebook or Instagram. Every every third post
Is a different ad of someone who’s going
To help your business do something.
How do you differentiate yourself to get that person
To actually be interested there?
That’s a good way to do it.
So if your superpower is connecting with people,
The other side of your superpower is your fatal flaw.
So talking about this in all of our shows,
Superman has his kryptonite. Batman is not actually super.
If you had to think through
One of your fatal flaws, what would you say it is?
And how have you sort of combated it or
Improved upon it over the years?
My fatal flaw and I’ve improved on this greatly,
Was always a couple things. And they go hand in hand,
It was constantly working to –
My the entire sales career has been commissioned only.
So that’s a different aspect of stress when you have a family
And stuff like that. So I was always constantly working
To generate my appointments. And to make sure that
I always was able to put food on the table, to a fault.
I was working too much. But I also fell into
The sales trap of being negative. So many sales reps
Complain about the leads. They complain about
How many phone calls they have to make.
They complain about this; Oh, they didn’t make enough money.
They didn’t make a sale and it’s all a constant
Avalanche of negativity. And all that stuff is sent out
To the universe. And you’re not going to get anything positive back
When all you’re thinking about is negative things.
So the year I wrote my book, which was 2018.
I made a conscious decision to change all that.
And I took every morning off entire year. Can you still hear me?
I got a little error.
I can hear you.
You still hear me? Okay, so I made a conscious decision.
I took every morning off for the year. And that’s when
I sat down every morning and I worked on writing my book.
And I stopped being negative. I stopped thinking negative thoughts.
Everything I was doing was going toward a positive result
Of writing my book and knowing I was in my happy place
Because writing is my happy place.
And it was incredibly eye opening, how many positive things
Came back to me once I did that. And for example,
There’s a certain amount of appointments we run
Every single go year. And there’s three
Appointments slots a day. So I called my boss in the middle
Of January and said, “I’m taking every morning off
For the entire year.” And obviously, he wasn’t too happy about that.
But he supported me and it was literally 30%
Less appointments now, and again, keep in mind,
He’s commissioned only sales, so. And at the end of the year,
I ran 165 less appointments than I did the year before.
But I sold a half a million dollars more in revenue.
And I attribute that to a better mindset, a positive mindset.
And a less is more attitude of not
Constantly focusing on the sale, but constantly focusing on
Helping people and staying positive and
I’m living proof that it works. And the book got done.
And it’s on Amazon and it’s published and now I’m here
And I’m ready to phase myself out of day-to-day selling
And get into the realm of speaking and
Coaching and sales consulting work.
So that’s where you get the whole idea
That selling more by selling less.
Sounds about right, right, exactly right.
Real world experience. That’s awesome.
So by sort of combating that negativity flaw and
Replacing it with positivity, it’s almost like a stress reduction.
Because I know, I had the same thing going in my life.
I was working 18 hours a day, every day, trying to figure out
I remember, if I go back four or five years,
How, basically, working my ass off to make sure
We put food on the table with my own agency and
That kind of stuff. And I mean, there’s nothing wrong with that.
Sometimes I say you have to, everyone has to go through their
Stage where they just have to excuse the language,
Eat the shit. You have to. They have to put in the hard work.
There’s nothing wrong with hard work.
And you go through there. But you realize at some point
That once you’ve mastered your skill, that it doesn’t require
Nearly as much of your effort get significantly greater results.
You can reduce your time input, and you’re much happier
Then you start getting better results all the way through.
So I’ve seen that happen in my own life, as well,
Which is really interesting.
I tell people all the time, what is your happy place?
What do you love to do? And not only professionally,
But personally and for me, it’s always been writing so –
But I hadn’t written in years. I mean, I would write
A short story every now and then. But I was always selling,
I was always … and scheduling that time to be –
To do your happy thing or to do the thing that makes you happy,
Is going to change your life really well. You need to set aside,
Don’t be afraid to set aside that time.
Because if you’re doing what you like,
And then you change your attitude to a positive attitude,
You’re going to get the things back twice as fun
As you … previous. Absolutely. 1,000%.
I like that. You talked about scheduling it too.
You’re actually talking about putting that into your day.
Saying this is my – I’ve been talking about it as giving yourself
Permission to play. And if you schedule it into your calendar
And say this is the time where I get to go and do me.
And it’s different for everyone. For me, it’s playing with my kids
And going kayaking and stuff like that.
And you’re putting that into the calendar.
And I think one of the things that I found
At least, is if I put it in the calendar, say that’s what this time is for,
Then what I’m actually in that I’m not thinking
About all the things I should be doing.
Because I’ve given myself permission to just be there
And be present with myself.
Absolutely. And it’s amazing because -here’s another example.
So, obviously with in-home selling and now you’re building
A whole list of customers, so I would be contacted
By customers all the time, whether it’s with a referral,
Or I’ve got a problem or something doesn’t work.
I have to set up a service. So that’s what I would be spending
My mornings doing. But once I started writing
And focusing on my book. Those calls, remarkably, almost disappeared.
I would go a whole week without hearing from a customer.
Because most of the time, with customers going to call you,
It’s usually not good news.
They’re not calling you to just to say hello.
But once all that positivity started, I started putting that out there,
I would be writing and I would – Everything was going great
In selling and at work. And I wouldn’t have to worry
About any issues or what they say ‘putting out fires.’
So then the book is finished. It took me five months
To write the book. Now it’s in the editing stages.
So now I’m done. Now, I still have my mornings off
And the two weeks I didn’t write,
And I’m like, “What am I going to do now?”
I got the most calls from customers I had all year.
And my editor, she told me, she’s like, “Allan, what’s going on?”
I said, “I’m all of a sudden, I’m inundated
With all of these calls from work and
Everybody’s complaining and blah, blah, blah.”
She goes, “You’re not writing.”
What does that have to do anything,
She goes, “Just write, trust me.”
So I just decided to write a short story.
And the calls went away again. So it’s such a powerful thing
Where you’re doing what you want to do, your energy changes,
So much that you start bringing that stuff back to yourself.
Absolutely. So, it’s a vital part of really being successful
Is understanding how to have that positive energy
In your life every day. So talk a little bit about
Your common enemy. So specifically,
About my what?
Your common enemy. So I want to talk about –
The common enemy?
Common enemy, which is
In reference to your sales coaching and sales training
That you do now, when you work with a salesperson.
If you could remove one thing from their life,
From their mindset, from their thinking and it would immediately
Change the results they were getting, what would that thing be?
It would be what I mentioned at the beginning of the interview
That they need to change the mindset from
Selling someone to helping someone.
They need to make that switch.
It’s, “I’m here to help you, Mr. Smith, I’m not here to sell you.”
That small switch, that small mindset is enormous
For a salesperson because the second you do that,
Now it’s all about the customer. And it’s not about you.
If you don’t worry about whether or not you make the sale,
If that’s not in your mind at all, you’re going to come across
Much more relaxed. You’re going to come across
Much more as a person who wants to help the customer.
And sorry, I’m getting texts in the middle this and
That’s in the very beginning, my book is like
If you’re going to do anything at all, from this book,
Help someone, don’t sell them.
And I guarantee your sales will increase quite a bit.
So for someone who is – because I’ve been in this position.
For someone who is thinking,
“Okay, I hear you, I hear you that I need to help people.
But I really need to make these sales because if I don’t
I’m not going to feed my kids today.
How do they make that mental shift?
When they’re sitting in those situations?
It’s not easy. I mean, it is because …
They’ve spent so much time, like I did, with the stress of
I need to make the sale because I need to feed my family.
But you have to at some point, take that leap of faith and say,
“Well, this isn’t working right now.”
Yes, I’m closing 30% of my customers and
I’m making this amount of money. But if you really
Want to make money, and you really want to be happy
With what you’re doing – … the other thing in sales
I also pulled a bunch of salespeople, and I asked them,
“Do you actually like selling?” Majority of them said, “Yeah.”
They kind of like selling more from a meeting person stand-
Meeting people standpoint. But they hated doing the sales pitch.
So you got, on one hand, you got people who don’t want
To meet with sales people. On the other hand,
You got sales people who don’t like doing a sales pitch.
It’s a wonder anything is sold at all.
And I’ve told that exact question, I had a couple weeks ago,
With a rep I was training. And she said to me, she goes,
“But I need to make sales. I can’t just trust
That helping someone is going to do it.”
I said, “You’re going to need to trust it. Because if you don’t
You’re just going to stay in the same position you are right now.
You have to trust that changing that mindset that
Helping people will increase your sales.
And then once it starts to happen, once you make a sale or two,
You start feeling more confident and doing it
And then it just snowballs exponentially from there.
And just thinking about a little bit if people who are being sold
Don’t like being sold and sales people don’t like giving
A sales pitch, but yet 30% of people still buy.
The reality is that the problems people are facing,
Are big enough to overcome their dislike of sales.
And the salesperson dislike of giving the sales pitch,
Which means if you remove all of that the problem is still there.
And they still want it solved. So if you if you just focus on that,
That they have a problem and you have a solution.
You’ve removed all the friction so naturally,
Your sales are going to go up.
You took the words out of my mouth.
It’s a when the friction is gone, people feel more comfortable.
I remember very vividly my very first sales job
Was with a sunroom company, years and years and years ago.
And the guy who owned it, he was a great guy.
He was an old time sales rep kind of, briefcase, carry-on guy,
But he also was very affable and likeable.
And he said to me once he goes, “Out of 10 people you meet
Two of them will always buy, and two of them will never buy.”
He goes, “Guaranteed what you do …
Is going to determine your success and sales.”
And he’s kind of right, you can go on in and
… You totally FUBAR your presentation, you screw up
And they still buy from you because they just need the product.
And then you do the best presentation in the world.
It’s where, it’s Academy Award worthy and
They don’t buy anyway. So you’re meeting those type of people
To feel comfortable with you,
But the six in the middle, the ones who need
Need to feel comfortable with the product, but are –
Don’t know who to go to, are going to choose you
Over the person that’s giving the sales pitch.
And that’s where it goes, if you sell four of those six,
Now you’re six out of 10. And you’re a rock star.
Absolutely. So, I mean, it just complete changes
The mathematics of the game too.
Because now you’re you’re playing a different game
Than other people are. I’ve found that in pretty much
Every industry I’ve ever been in, that you have to play
A different game than most people are playing
If you want to succeed. Even when I went to try getting
A high level marketing position I had,
It was a working to get a job. And that’s which is really sales.
People don’t realize that putting out a job interview
And doing all that kind of stuff. You’reselling yourself
And just approached it absolutely differently
Than most people do. And beat out 250 other people
For the position. Because you play a different game.
And you went to the job interview with the same mindset
It’s like, “Here’s the problem you have in this space.
And here’s the solutions I have for you.”
And we didn’t even do this normal interview game.
What’s your, something that you’re good at, or whatever,
I don’t even know what the interview –
How the interview things go. But I asked all these
Stupid questions that aren’t relevant. I remember actually
Going in an interview and being like, I don’t want to do all of that.
But I want to do is I want to talk about the problems you have
And the solutions I have for them. And we spent an hour
And a half talking about all those things.
They hired me over 250 other people
Because you play a different game.
It just changes the way things work. So as you’re driving force,
Just like Spider Man fights to save New York or
Batman fights to save Gotham or Google fights
To index all the world’s information.
What is your mission? What is it that you fight for?
Well, I think now, at this point, when I really decided to write a book,
My mission is to get rid of rip-the-trust-a-phobia.
I want the world to start trusting sales people again.
I want them to feel comfortable with, “I gotta go buy,
I gotta go buy a stereo today. And I really want to talk
To the sales rep because I know that guy in that store. …
He helps me out. I mean, think about how many times
In your life, you’ve actually met a salesperson that you’ve liked,
And they’ve helped you and you didn’t feel any pressure?
How many times do you recommend?
You fall over people trying to send people to that person.
Because he or she is so different. It’s the same with anyone.
Recommendations come from people that you like,
But especially in a sales situation,
Have you ever met a car salesman that you actually liked?
“Oh, my god, you’re telling everyone you know,
To go to that car salesman, because you don’t want them
To get ripped off by anybody else.” So I would say my mission
Is to make as many sales people that type of salesperson,
Going forward in my trainings and my teachings,
Because I want people to like sales people again, I really do.
It’s a great profession. I think it’s a noble profession,
Like you said, it makes the world go round.
And it’s just unfortunate that the entire sales training history
Has been to coerce customers into and
To follow a pitch and sell it all costs.
And it’s interesting too, because when you think about it from
The business standpoint, of course, that’s how
You’re going to train. You’re gonna to train people to get the sale.
Because that’s what the bottom line is about.
Of course, I understand that. That’s the bottom line.
Yeah. So like, of course, that’s the way it goes.
If there’s a way to, I mean – So I’m not saying to eliminate
The sales pitch, everyone should go through
The training process that the company has.
But then once you have the training process,
Then you take the techniques that I have to distill yourself
From the salesperson that they’re training you to be,
And that combination will make you, I guarantee,
It will make you one of the top sales reps in the country
Because you’re not following what everyone else is doing.
Deliver sentence by sentence.
Absolutely. So let’s move forward a littlebit.
Talk about your heroes tool belt. So we talk, maybe you have
A big magical hammer like Thor or maybe you have
A cool bulletproof vest, like the neighborhood police officer
Or maybe just really love the way Evernote helps you
Organize your thoughts? Do you have a set of tools you use
That really help you in your either preparing for sales or
Helping teach people sales, or –
That really just helps you accomplish your goal on a daily basis
For doing what you do?
Well, I mean, The Seven Secrets are part of my tool belt
When I’m meeting with someone. But the preparation,
I think, comes from a work ethic standpoint,
But also knowing when to say, “Okay, I’m done for today.”
I did this, I did my two hours worth of work, if I keep going,
It’s not going to be very productive.
Or it could be the opposite of that. So I would say my work ethic
Is in my tool belt, my seven secrets,
When meeting with a customer. Absolutely.
I also think one of the things that I’m proud of with
About myself, is how I can adjust and think on my feet,
I mean, you absolutely need to be that way.
You need to have a personality when you’re in sales anyway.
But if you can figure out how to adjust to situations
In front of you quickly, like body language, for example,
I have a whole chapter on body language. If you’re noticing
Someone’s doing something with regard to their,
How they just held their hands, or what they did.
Did they scratch the back of their neck, or they did something
With their eyebrows, those subtle hints, you need to
Have that type of technique in your tool belt because that’s critical.
I’ve never met, I’ve never been in any sales training
That teaches body language to salespeople.
And it’s the top three most critical thing you need to watch
For people just plow through their sales presentation,
Not even paying attention to the person in front of them
Who’s ready to throw up becausethey can’t listen anymore.
So body language is another thing that I’m very,
I think I’m very good at. And I trained with that.
And I always concentrate on body language.
And it’s incredibly helpful. It’s saved many sales,
It’s taken sales into it and taken an appointment into
A different direction than what it was going in.
When I met, when I noticed there was some
Negative body language. So I think that’s important too.
But knowing how to think on your feet,
Understanding body language. And really knowing
The personality of the customer in front of you, is also important.
I think body language is an interesting tool to understand.
I’ve been through some sales training
That talks about body language. But it was it was not,
Let me rephrase that it was more leadership training.
That talked about body language. And it just applies readily
To sales training. And like learning things like
Seeing the difference between closed and open,
And forward and back, and that kind of stuff, and how you can
Use your body language to pull people into
More positive stance and stuff like that.
Because there’s so much of the communication is happening.
Without the words and the sounds and stuff that are happening.
Most of its with the way that you’re sitting and the way
That you’re standing and the way that the other person
Is responding to you. And you can tell when you say things,
How they’re responding just by their physical like the –
It’s like the words hit them physically.
And like learning to just be cognizant of that.
And it’s something that I’ve spent a long time doing.
I went to a Bible College and learned to do
Preaching professionally from professionally trained preachers.
And one of the things they taught us was a lot of body language
And manipulation and stuff like that. On how to to manipulate
Your own body language to help other people
Be more comfortable with you. And it’s something I’ve gotten
Pretty natural at it. But it’s a it’s a learned skill.
It’s not an innate thing. And it’s something you can practice
And get better at. And you’ll definitely notice an improvement
In everything from all the way down to working with
Disciplining your children. Even your young kids
Who are not very –
A hundred percent.
You completely change the game with-
I’ve got a two and a half year old, right now who’s –
I’ve got, I got four of them, but one of them’s two and a half.
And she can say a bunch of nouns. But other than that
She’s communicates terribly.
A lot of its body language. And …
Even with your pets, they’re not worried about
Their body language, you can tell right away
Your dog or your cat, what they’re feeling
Because of their body language. And there’s so many things –
One of the things I learned in body language many years ago
Was a lot of people don’t realize is that people think
Facial expressions are the best way to read a person.
And it’s actually the worst way, because a lot of people
Can fake their facial expressions, they can fake the smile,
Their eyebrows, things like that. But your feet, a person’s feet
Is the true indicator of what a person’s feeling.
Because it’s virtually impossible for someone to think about
Positioning their feet a certain way. So that is in
Complete contradiction. If you go to, in-home selling one on one,
They will teach you, you have to go into the house,
And you have to sit Mrs. here and Mr. there and you have to be
There and you have to take control of the situation.
And you have to sit at the kitchen table,
And you have to do all these things. And it’s all about control.
And what I learned was, “You know what,
Let’s sit in the living room and be relaxed on the couch.”
And it’s amazing what happens because it’s no longer
A formal meeting at the table. You’re sitting at the couch.
You’re relaxed, I can watch their feet and legs
Very easily at that point. And you’re just in a more of a discussion
Rather than a sales presentation. And that is so much more
Successful than setting up people at a kitchen table.
It’s sometimes, it’s difficult when you’re meeting someone
Behind a desk, but if you get them out from behind the desk,
Sit in the two chairs or somewhere else in the office
Where there’s not that almost, that adversarial situation.
So try to get people out and expose, we can watch them fully
And feel much more comfortable,
Rather than the formal way that it’s being trained.
And one of the things that – Online since I do most of my sales online.
One of the things that I’ve switched to
Over the last couple of years is doing all of my calls.
Instead of audio calls, we do video calls like this.
I don’t know, the connection level this new technology allows for it,
But being able to see their face and see their shoulders, has been –
There’s so much more to it. So, one of the things that this
Something I do intentionally, which probably not a lot of people
Would recognize on the show, but like there’s a reason
I’m sitting at a 45 degree angle to the camera
When I do these interviews and have a forward sitting stance
Because it’s a positive body energy, which is something I know
Versus like if I were to sit back like this.
That’s more of like a negative body energy.
So like there’s there’s a reason for those things,
Which is like their minor. But it makes for I think,
Like this situation isn’t a sales situation. But it makes for
A more, like you said, relaxed atmosphere.
And one of the things I’m going for in the show is like
A whole like fireside chat, like we’re sitting around
The fire at night and just chatting about the things
That we’re excited about. And when you approach sales that way,
Then you’re talking about problems and solutions with a friend,
Instead of looking at your customer as an enemy
You have to conquer to get the sale,
Which just changes the game.
Absolutely. And and even those little subtle things like
Positioning yourself in a way where it’s positive,
It’s a positive position. It’s subconsciously,
It’s called your limbic brain, it subconsciously makes
The customer feel good about you. They don’t know why.
They really don’t, but they just like you like,
“Oh, I like this guy. I’m not sure why but -”
And it’s simply because of how your positioning your body
Toward them. And the energy you’re sending out.
If you lean back and like cross your arms and
Do one of these things. Now you’re aloof and
You’re the typical salesperson who doesn’t care about
The customer, just by doing this, it’s –
I have a have a quick body language story for you.
So I was in an appointment and was with an older couple.
It was actually a rather large purchase.
So I asked them at the end how they would like to pay for it
Because they wanted to, they were thinking about financing.
So the wife said, “You know what, I think we’re going to do
The 12 month no interest plan.” And I said, “Okay.”
She pointed to the area on the computer.
And I looked at the husband and he pursed his lips.
Kind of just went like that, very briefly, pursed his lips.
And anytime you see a lip pursed, it’s not a good thing.
It’s never a good thing. So I immediately said,
“You know what, I need to go outside and make a phone call
Let you guys chat about what you’d want to do here
From a payment standpoint, I’ll be right back.”
I went outside for five minutes, I came back in,
And he took over the conversation. He says,
“You know what, we’re going to do the monthly payment
Instead of the 12 months.” I said, “Okay, great.”
And they were, he was completely much more relaxed.
She was relaxed because they had time to think about it.
And the sale went through. And I thought to myself,
If I didn’t acknowledge or recognize that lip pursed,
He could have absolutely want to went ahead
With the sale because he didn’t want to embarrass his wife
Or have a financial discussion in front of me.
And then it could have been cancelled the next day,
Because he wasn’t comfortable paying
For the entire job in 12 months.
He would have exercised that 3-day right to rescind.
And if I didn’t recognize the lip pursed,
I firmly believe that sale would have cancelled,
Or they may not have even bought that night
Because he just was not comfortable with that program.
And it’s interesting, because one of the other things that
I do, you’ll never see this, but like one of the ways
That I sit on the show, when I do these things,
I actually have my legs crossed in relaxed position,
My ankles up on my knee kind of thing.
Because it’s the way that you would sit with a friend.
It’s right up the way that you would sit with with someone.
And it’s like, I know that my guests will never see that,
Because this is shoulders up kind of thing.
But your body language, the way that you’re presenting yourself
And with other people’s that … energy comes through
All the way and it’s so interesting how powerful body language is
When you learn to see it and recognize it.
And one of the things that – one of the techniques I learned
In my younger years. Back in my preaching days was
This thing they call mirroring and matching.
Where you can adjust someone else’s body language
By matching them and then changing.
Because people will … all your body language.
So if you see them in a negative position,
You can actually take their negative position and
Then move into other positions and they’ll follow you.
And and you can change the energy in a room by learning
To sort of pay attention to that kind of body language,
And learn how to how to move it and stuff.
So I know it’s fascinating to me.
It really is. Body language is absolutely critical.
And it should be part of every sales training for every company.
And most of the time it’s not. You have to go to
A special leadership function or something like that.
They have anyone even mentioned it.
As I said, I learned it at leadership stuff. But super cool.
Music is by https://www.purple-planet.com
So move on a little bit and talk about –
I want to talk about your own personal heroes.
Frodo had Gandalf, Luke had Obi Wan,
Robert Kiyosaki had his Rich Dad.
Who were some of your heroes, were they real life mentors?
Were they speakers or authors are they peers
Who were just a few years ahead of you?
And how important were they to
What you’ve accomplished so far in your sales career?
Most of my heroes, I guess would be would have been authors.
I’m a big reader. And when I was younger, couldn’t get enough of
Stephen King. Love how he wrote.
Love how he wrote the reader in. Kind of modeled
My fiction writing to how he wrote. I think one of my favorite books
Ever is his memoir, it’s called On Writing. He just talks about
How he writes and it’s just fascinating if you’re an actual writer.
So writers, the business, writers like Napoleon Hill,
Those type of guys who talked about
Not only motivation and success, but being positive and
Things like that. Those types of books always kind of
Hold a special place for me because there’s so many
Sales books out there that just talk about closing, closing, closing
And how to win the sale and how to handle objections,
And all these godforsaken boring techniques that don’t work.
And just make people even more resistant to buying something.
So the the authors that kind of thought outside the box
A little bit are the ones that I’m usually attracted to.
I’ve had a few mentors over the years, as well.
Early on in my career, in athletics, as a mentor
That trained a lot with me
And even that guy on the Sunroom company,
He was an old time Rep.
But he also thought around, and thought outside the box, too.
And I learned some pretty good lessons with him.
I remember once, I went on a sales call with him
When he was training me. And he did the call.
And I sat there and I was like,
I thought this was the greatest appointment ever.
And the people didn’t buy. So we get in the car,
And I’m driving away, he looks at me, and he says,
“So what do you think? Do you think they’re going to buy anything?”
I’m like, “Absolutely. They’re calling you back tomorrow.”
He’s like, “There’s 100% chance they’re not buying anything.”
And I looked at him like, “That was a great presentation.”
He goes, “I’m just telling you, I’ve been doing this for 30 years.
They’re not calling me back.” And I learned a lesson there.
Like so many sales reps think that they do a good job,
And did a great presentation. But they should just
Start keeping track of all the good presentations
That you didn’t sell and see how many actually call you back?
Not many. So you miss something somewhere
That made them not comfortable enough to purchase that
When you were meeting with them.
So, he was a mentor of mine, as well.
And I learned a lot from him. So, but I would say
A lot of authors and some certain people in my life.
So how important would you say, having mentors has been
To you achieving what you’ve achieved so far?
I mean, having mentors is I think it’s critical.
I think everyone needs to have someone that they could,
That they can talk to and lean on and sort of emulate.
But I think the best thing a mentor can ever do for you
Is to make you find your true self, who you are.
You don’t want to copy someone completely.
You want to be who you are. And if your mentor
Is going to part his or her wisdom on you,
When you take that wisdom and turn it into
Your own way of doing things, I think that’s the best way
To use a mentor. But you got to be open to it,
As well as a lot of people that don’t have mentors
Because they don’t think they need one.
So one of the things that I found really interesting about
The whole mentor discussion is that a lot of people
Will find a mentor. And then what they try to do
Is copy the mentor and make themselves like a mini-me of the mentor,
The person they’re learning from. And depending on the person
Who’s doing the teaching, sometimes they teach that way.
Whether it be like, “Hey, this is what’s worked for me,
You should do the same thing.” And what I’ve seen is that
The reality is the thing that works for them
May or may not work for you. So you have to be able
To back out the things that they’re doing into the principles
And then apply the principles to yourself. In the things that
Make you make you tick. The things make you come alive.
And so you have to be able to back out the tactics
Into the principles and then apply principles uniquely.
The best mentors know how to do that. But even if they don’t,
You can still learn from someone who’s
Rock solid at what they do. And if you can learn to
Back out their tactics into the principles and apply the principles.
That’s like one of the best ways to actually
Make use of the mentors.
I agree. That’s a good point. Very good point.
So last question on the show is your guiding principles.
So what are the top one or two, principles or actions
That you use every day, that contribute to your success
In your business? Maybe ones that you wish you’d known
When you first started out on your hero’s journey?
One that I can tell you. So at the end of the book,
I talk about an acronym that I came up with called ATMA
And ATMA is four words that that kind of help you
Achieve what you want to do, but also kind of keep you
On the right path. And the C in ACMA stands for calibrate.
And what I mean by calibrate is, I have on my calendar,
Every Monday morning, it pops up on my phone
And just says calibrate. And what I mean by that is,
Take a step back, once a week. Maybe even
Just once every couple days. It’s up to you really, and calibrate
Where you’re going, where you came from,
What path you’re on. Does everything seem like you’re in the right –
You’re going in the right direction? You’re in the car?
Are you on the right path? Are you following the GPS?
Or did you also all of a sudden,
Did you cut down a side road and now
You don’t know where you are. So a lot of times
If you don’t do that. If you don’t kind of take a step back
And look at what you’ve been doing and where you’re going.
You could go in the wrong direction for quite a long time.
So for me putting the calibrate as a weekly habit that I have now,
Really has been – I couldn’t live without a map
Because quite often it’ll pop up my phone, I’ll stop what I’m doing.
All right, this is what I did. This is where I’m going.
Things look good. And I’m like, “Okay, great.”
It’s a five minute exercise. I like the way things are going,
I move on. But sometimes I’m like, “Wow, you know what,
I’m heading this way. But I really should be doing this.”
And what I did last Tuesday didn’t really work.
So you kind of can just assess everything and fix it.
It’s like calibrating the weight machine to say
You’re lifting 25 pounds instead of 21. If you keep it at 21
And people think they’re lifting 25, then they’re not getting
The help they need. So you got to calibrate yourself.
And fix yourself and make sure you’re always
On the right path and that everything in you
Is working properly. That’s one of the things that I use a lot.
So I really like the word calibrate
Because it has some some special meaning to me.
My dad is a scientist and the field that he’s in is metrology.
And a lot of people don’t know what metrology is.
They think he’s a meteorologist, which is
Someone who studies the weather, whatnot,
But at metrologist is someone who calibrates things for a living.
It’s the field of Weight Watchers. So so he does things
Like if your speedometer says you’re going 70 miles an hour,
You’re going 70 miles an hour, except he works
In the aerospace and engineering field. So it was –
If the chemical thermometer thing in the aerospace laser thingy
Says it’s minus 274 degrees or 73 degrees Kelvin.
That it’s actually minus 273 degrees Kelvin, that kind of stuff.
And if it’s off by a quarter, a 10th of a degree, everyone explodes.
So, that kind of stuff. And I remember one day
He brought me into – bring your kid today work,
Into work day kind of thing. And I’m sitting at his desk,
I’m 12 years old. And there’s this little thing looks like
A magic wand on his desk. And I picked it up and
I’m like lifting it up and down. And there’s a little display
On the counter the numbers are going up and down.
I’m like waving and loading the wall. And I’m like,
“This thing is super cool.” I’m like raising and lowering the wand.
And I’m like, “What is that?” He’s like, “It’s a barometer”
So barometer measures atmospheric pressure.
And this thing has like six zeroes on it after the decimal point.
And it’s measuring atmospheric pressure
To the thousandth of an inch.
On the on the thing. And I was like, “It’s a barometer.”
I knew what a barometer was. It’s an atmospheric pressure
Kind of thing. And I’m waving it up and down.
And he’s like, “It’s accurate down to a 10,000th of an inch
Or something like that.” And he’s like, “You should put it down.”
And I was like, “Why?”
He’s like, “Because that’s a $2 million one.
And I’m like, “Oh, yeah, I’ll set that down right there.”
So calibration, it’s something like when you realize
That the some of the biggest, most fanciest systems in the world,
They have to be calibrated on a regular basis.
So the airplanes, the cars, everything, it’s not something
That you realize until you’ve had someone
Who’s in that space, when my dad retired,
He actually, he took a secondary job just to fill his time
Working for a beer company. And one of the things that
They didn’t have a calibration team. And so they had
Something like $800,000 a month in waste
That they weren’t aware of. Then he came in, because
Beer has to be done at a certain, I don’t even know
How it all works. But it was like, you have to produce
Enough bottles for the amount of beer that you’re making.
And beer only has a certain amount of time
That it can be finished and before it’s bottled. So you have to
Measure all of these things. We make this much beer,
We need this many bottles at this amount of time
In this short window. And because they didn’t,
They hadn’t calibrated any of those things I didn’t know.
They didn’t know how many bottles to produce for everything.
They were just sort of guessing based on what’s worked
And they grew so fast, they didn’t really have a cell down.
So we had to set up an entire calibration system and
Reduce their waste by something like $100,000 a month
Because calibration is huge. And when companies
Don’t realize that they need it, then they they end up
With with big problems. So I like that
You’re actually taking something that it’s one of those
Hidden science fields that not a lot of people know exists.
But a lot of your biggest companies,
Their calibration department is a big, highly paid department
And realizing that you have to have that
Same kind of calibration in your own life.
Or like, “Am I going in the right direction? Am I doing these things?”
Because if you’re going for a long ways,
If you’re off by a quarter of a degree.
You’ll end up in a different country.
It’s 1,000% I mean, in the book, I write just what you said,
I’m like, I start the … the chapter by saying,
This needs to be calibrated, blah, blah, blah,
All these things need to be calibrated.
Even toilets need to be calibrated. But then I write,
Have you ever calibrated yourself?
And it’s just a simple concept. But I’ve never really
Heard of it before. And so I kind of made it into
A concept of this acronym.
So ATMA stands for Animate, which means start.
Start. Whatever you need to do, start it.
Animate, Calibrate, Motivate, and then Adulate.
And the last one, Adulate is something that
I don’t think a lot of people do as well is, praise yourself.
Stop being negative, stop looking in the mirror
And complaining about yourself or saying,
“I look like crap.” Praise yourself instead.
And if you do those four things, and you keep
Those four things in mind, in anything you do,
You’ll become much more successful.
I like that. I like the Adulate it that’s a good.
That’s like a $4 word for today.
So I’m pretty much brings us to the end of the interview.
I do one last thing on the show with every guest,
I call it the Hero’s Challenge. It’s pretty simple.
And it’s basically this, do you have someone in your network
That you think has a good entrepreneurial story
That’s worthy of sharing on our show? Who is it?
First names are fine, and why do you think
They should come on the show?
Someone in my network that has a good entrepreneur –
Actually, I do know someone.
She’s an amazing networker and event planner.
And her name is Pam in Providence, Rhode Island.
And she blows me away because I go to the networking events
That are that are supposedly, these organizations networking,
After work and things like that, and you go to them
And sometimes there’s 12 people, a good one, there’s 20.
Pam’s events routinely have 100-250 people
On a weekly basis or a monthly basis. Don’t know how she does it.
So she probably someone to chat with.
That’s fascinating. Those networking things.
I’ve been to a lot of them. And you’re right.
Most of them have 10-20 people
Never been to one that has 150 people at it.
I went to my first one with her two weeks ago.
And when I called her, I said, “Well how you know,
Because I was actually going to be a vendor with my book.”
And I said, “How many books should I bring?”
I was thinking, there’s gonna be 20 people.
She goes, “Well, we have 120 signed up right now.”
Like, “You have 120 RSVP confirmed?” Like, “Yep.”
And that’s about how many showed up that night. It’s crazy.
It’s awesome. Okay, so we’ll definitely reach out and see
If we can connect with her through you after the show.
But so at this point, thank you so much
For being on the show, Allan.
Last question. Pretty easy. Where can people find you
If they want to get sales coaching or sales training
Or pick up your book. And lastly, along with that,
Who would be an ideal person to reach out
If they were going to reach out?
Well, obviously, sales managers have reached out to me
Talking about me coming in and talking to their group.
Individual sales people, I’d be happy to speak with with
People like that on a – I’m not going to,
I’m not like a lawyer where I charge you $100
Call me on the phone. I’d be happy to chat with people.
I enjoy doing that. But go to my website,
Which is https://allanger.com/
So it’s A-L and then L-A-N-G-ER https://allanger.com/
On there, you can find, you can click on there
To buy my book, it’ll take you to Amazon.
You can schedule, you can send me an email.
You can schedule a consultation. Reach out to me.
There’s a all my informations on there.
So https://allanger.com/ and also on my website,
I have an offer where you can get
The first two chapters of my book for free.
You click on the link, it will take you to a PDF.
Where you can actually read the first two chapters
And if you like it at the end of that you can click on there
And will take you to Amazon to buy the entire book.
Awesome. So thank you so much for being on the show.
If you’re listening and you think you need help with
With sales training, definitely take time to reach out to Al.
Again, it’s https://allanger.com/
I think I’m probably going to pick up a copy of your book too.
I always love sales training books that are in the vein
Of thinking, that I like. So, again, thank you
For being on the show. Really appreciate it.
It was a lot of fun. Thank you, Richard. Appreciate it.
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What Is The Hero Show?
A peak behind the masks of modern day super heroes. What makes them tick? What are their super powers? Their worst enemies? What's their kryptonite? And who are their personal heroes? Find out by listening now